Thoughts on Boks

Yesterday's game was easily the worst of the season thus far for the Boks. Yes it was away from home, yes Argentina is far away, yes yes yes...

My least favourite bits...

The Boks appear incapable of passing the ball from 10 through the hands to the wing. Disagree? How many times did we see it? Maybe twice in 80 minutes.

On that note, I do not want to hear about how Tests are so much closer and tighter and and and... . Bordeaux would have won that game by at least 30 points. It's becoming embarrassing how we pick these explosive backlines and then can't ever seem to set AE up to run onto the ball at pace, Moodie gets the ball may 3 times in 80, Fassi isn't allowed to run anything back at the opposition and the entire backline are basically high ball chasers and rush defenders. It sucks, it's stupid and I can't understand why we do it...especially against such an inexperienced Argie side.

Reinach was damn slow and kept pissing away all momentum by continually taking his sweet time to clean from the base. I kept yelling at my TV "Hurry the F up and pass the bloody ball."

The box kicking throughout the game was atrocious. I mean, I know it was windy but for heaven's sake ADAPT!

There were a few more negatives but those are my main gripes.

Now for the positives...

Cam's stock rose massively in everyone's books. Rightly so. I remain in awe of him. He looks massive too. I think after his injuries he's been told to pack on some more muscle.

Fassi finally seems to be getting some of his form back. He was by no means excellent but he showed a few glimpses of the old Fassi. He made a few kak decisions, but at least he did a few very good things too.

Eben looked busy and strong. I like how he got through the game and I think he'll be ready for the ABs.

Porthen's star continues to rise. That step and the ground he made after, and his scrumming, I very much look forward to the next decade of seeing him do similar. He keeps looking impressive despite still being a baby. Does anyone disagree?

The contentious...

People seem to be down on BJD. I didn't think he did that badly.

Marco came on and provided some nice impetus, but I see a few comments about how he did nothing. Again, I thought he was somewhere between a 6 and 7.5.

Elrigh is starting slow. I don't have him pegged as a guy that will impress many in his first few seasons but I have a feeling that he's the attritional type that will gradually build into Test rugby and at some point we won't question his presence any longer. Just a hunch and just my opinion.

Quite a shyte game against a shyte team. Of course the YouTubers are all calling Argentina's performance mind blowing and amazing but they were bloody terrible. The Boks were just slightly less terrible.

I don't really have anything else to say other than Roos' stock plummeted on Friday night and Cam's shot up last night. That's probably a majority opinion at the moment. Roos needs to reinvent himself. He gone as far as this current incarnation will take him and he needs to re-examine his rugby identity.

Also, some lekker commentary on the match thread. Reading all the comments and making a few of my own certainly adds to the enjoyment of the game. Always a pleasure, lads.

Hi there Plumpster. I was hoping you would say AE showed he lacks the silky skills of Allende. We learned again why Kriel and Allende are out test combo.
In respect of the returning players the big positive for me was Eben playing a full match and playing well. Lood will not replace Nortje who has a phenomenal work rate lasting 80 minutes. But it's nice to have him back as an option.
Kolisi did well until his injury. Have to see what that is about.
Du Toit though didn't exactly shine.
Ethan Hooker looked sharp, nice pace and a thinking player. Could make the test team. Edwil is a quality player and never let's you down.
With respect to the other players, Reinach takes too long to clear the ball and Morne looked better. Yes pity about all those high balls. The backline didn't function well.
The Stormers lose forward trio as a collective look more effective. Has more pace and energy. Hanekom was good but oaks are going over board. I suspect some oaks are desperate to take credit for punting this guy. I did like the fact that Cam is a workhorse. A possible move would see him come on off the bench to replace Du Toit who could move to lock to replace Eben. We may even see Hanekom starting at 6.Also means you do not have to overplay Wiese.
Quan Horn needs to be given a shot at 15.
Playing Williams, Kolbe and Willemse boosts the backline attack as does Allende and Kriel.
All in all I would say that there were many positives. Kolisi hopefully will recover quickly.
Lastly, I wonder how Sascha would do at 12. He is pretty physical and has great footwork and pace off the mark and an eye for the gap. Good passing skills and boot. The NZ second Flyhalf type of player. A very different type of player to Allende. Give Manie and Pollard the flyhalf roles. Probably too late to experiment now.
We need a pack that is both powerful and mobile. Once you shut down the Kiwi ballarinas backline you are well on the way to winning.

I know and get the whole "play to your strengths" thing. But right now the Boks has the worst back play out of any of probably the top 8 test sides. It might work for us, but it's such a drag to watch. Especially when executed so poorly and there is no adjustment in tactics evident. Our reliance on the slow grind and conquer is going to bite us at some point. Scotland and England got physical parity or better with us everywhere except scrumtime this year. Yesterday we ended one decent pass away from a draw.

Right now Sacha for me is #3 in the flyhalf pecking order behind Pollard and Manie. He is a prodigious individual talent but he creates no structure around him and his tactical kicking is pathetic. He nearly tanked the Edwill try yesterday with that floppy dippy pass to AE, who sublimely rescued and recovered the chance. Pollard immediately brought a measure of order and stability when he came on.

The Boks looked disjointed. Great, we have enough depth for 3 decent sides, but all these different combinations every week can't possibly settle into a cohesive match day performance. It's probably okay, it's a long season and 4 challenging games (we hope) against the All Blacks are coming up so you have to do the old switcheroo so the guys get recovery time. But it's clear the combinations and timing and understanding were way off. Made me think of Aussie under a new coach against Japan on Saturday - you could see they were trying something, going for the razzle dazzle but the guys just weren't able to find each other yet.

For the Boks of course much of this should iron itself out when our regular starting side goes on again. So that per se, not too concerning. What I hate, and it's a personal peeve, is seeing how just about every other test side is trying to play a more expansive and flowing game. Aus yesterday ran the ball from inside their own goal area. I'm not saying that's a good idea, but god love them for the effort and the enterprise despite also being under the cosh and needing to perform. The Boks are stuck in the kick and pray and bash them rut. We box kicked on the opposition 22 for crying out loud.

I see now there were 80 kicks in the game - 43 by the Boks. A kick a minute.

Agree with most of the rest of your thoughts, Plummie. Don't know about Elrigh, whether he'll amount to a regular test starter. With Cam, P Divvy and hopefully Ruan when he's fit, it's going to be a hard nut to crack even after '27.

This is a very interesting debate, I see where you'll coming from but my take is somewhat different and I guess most will disagree with me.
To me it's about selecting the very best for the WC.....that is the big picture, sure these are test matches and everyone wants to see the Boks in overdrive oozing confidence, playing in rhythm, cohesive and looking like a team inspiring confidence and trust.
Sorry, I put myself in Rassie's shoes.....he has a squad of 54 and he really doesn't know who to cull from the squad going to the WC. The tests leading into the WC is going to define his squad.....players will have to put their hands up to get into the squad, no player should be selected on reputation or on the promise of better things to come.
For example, he needs to know if Etzebeth is a victim of his age and whether he will still have enough in him to be competitive in another WC. And which player is the best alternative to Etzebeth? Who is his best loose trio? Rassie is asking questions of every single player, only they can give him the answers that he's looking for.
And so on a level playing field everyone gets an opportunity but at the end of the day he's saying....you tell me. He won't discard a player until he's been given a fair opportunity.

Training is one thing and most would impress but it's only in a match situation when we see the naked truth.
How many here would have wanted Roos in a bok jumper 2 years ago? Ask them same posters....how now?

First off Denny, to your point about the WC being everything, I can't agree. For a diehard traditionalist like me this first proper tour between SA and NZ in 30 years is as big as any RWC. I grew up in a time when tours were everything and until recently we had to wait 12 years for a proper old-fashioned tour with the British Lions. This RGR tour is huge for me, at least as big as any RWC.

As for the Boks playing style, I think we've all been calling for decades now for the Boks to play a more expansive game with less kicking but we can't argue this style we're playing works for us. Having said that, the last time we played the All Blacks in a test match we hardly kicked at all, we ran the ball and we gave them the biggest defeat they've had in their entire rugby history. I hope Rassie remembers that.

We do need Sacha back to his incomparable best though to play that kind of game. His kicking from hand was poor yesterday so all the more reason to give him license to run it more. Oh well, we'll know soon enough what Rassie decides.

I was one who was calling for Evan Roos to be a Bok and I won't argue that he's been disappointing of late, but I wouldn't write him off. He's got all the physical attributes, just needs to sort his head out . . . and tell his father to stop interfering.

Fly 16 hours, train for a few days in a hostile environment. Play a match in an even more hostile stadium in windy conditions in a "spoeg en plak span", knowing that another 16 hour flight awaits to get back to the rest of the squad, to prepare for the most anticipated test series in 30 years...

That's the context of the match ...it was always going to be a k@k affair.

The saving grace in all this is there is no other international team today that has the habit of winning. I think France has the talent and possibly England. But they don’t have the winning habit and France has the proclivity to do something really stupid just when they are set to win. If it’s going to be a NH team that challenges, they have to start by dominating the Six Nations. It’s still a crap shoot.

I don’t think Scotland, Australia and even Ireland have the talent now. Ireland did in 2023, that was their year.

Which leaves NZ. Do they really have the talent. Watching their scrum against the Stormers they look no better than last year. We still have to see their new 10, but what we saw on Friday was unimpressive. The pattern of play looked no better than Razor’s. It’s been a long time since they had world class centers. The only ABs who are sure starters in a joint team are Savea and Jordan.

Until we are faced with an opponent with the will to win and the talent, especially in the tight forwards, it’s advantage Boks. The obvious place for our opponents to start is the scrum. Find some props who can really scrum and avoid those costly scrum penalties at the sharp end of matches. De Groot and Newell are going to be breakfast if they are in the tests. This series ought to be a walk in the park.

I wonder what is wrong with the memory of the mamparas. One match doesn't define what has been happening for some time now. ie the Boks have been scoring a lot of tries via running rugby. Pakster appears to have total amnesia poor oak!

Plumpster I am glad you agree with my points made barring my comment regarding that loose forward attempting to play center.
DUD Mozzie got in a froth about my suggesting AE was lucky to get his pass away to Moodie. For DUD Mozzie who loves to rely on one play to define a players match this made AE a super star! Hahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Sascha is a natural runner with the ball with superlative skills required by a center. He looks like he could make a center. On the other hand with experience he could make a great flyhalf. I hope he finds his true path.
Mike obviously was not watching Eben who lasted 80 minutes and had a fine outing. Hats off to the legend.

For me Reinach dictated the course of play - he was annoyingly pathetic. I’ve asked the question for some time now - what the hell is he still doing in the mix, he was passed it some time back and somehow miraculously leapfrogged Faf who was always the better and slightly younger option.

Our forwards did a good enough job of supplying ball only for Reinach to saunter to the base, take an age to decide what to do, giving the Argies all day to align their defence and then when he had decided the course of action it was laboured and pedantic

What’s the point of having Sacha, AE and Moodie outside you lif you are not going to provide them with a crisp, sharp service giving them the opportunity to challenge the opposition?

I was screaming for Reinach to be replaced with vd Bergh only for him to fall pretty flat as well.

It was really disappointing to see us unable to dictate play. We should have dominated and dictated terms.

Individually Fassi showed improvement but is still off the pace, Edwil was good. Hooker was disappointing with his kick chase. AE had a game to forget, Moodie never saw the ball. Sacha had his moments - is a real warrior

The tightfive were solid enough. I like Grobelaar but he is more of an impact player as lacks grunt. Kolisi was good while he lasted. Elrigh Louw is still struggling to regain his pre injury influence and certainly does not merit selection ahead of Roos for a start

Hanekom stood tall without being exceptional. Off the bench Porthen, Pollard and Cobus Wiese added value. BJD was solid enough

A game to forget for the Boks but at least we managed to win it ugly

Get rid of bloody 36 year old Reinach - there are 5 better younger 9 options than him

I think a lot of people have to remember that this was a warm up game for those players that have missed lots of rugby this year and for those fringe players that are in need of minutes.
We can agree that it was dire rugby to watch with all the kicking and dis-jointed attack but if I'm Rassie why would I give the AB's analysts anything to study for 2 weeks before possibly our greatest games outside a WC.

Our flyhalf(s) only passed the ball to the centers twice in 83 minutes. There was no shape in our phase play, when we had more than 2 phases. The plan was to kick everything, live off chaos and scraps. Get out with the win by just physically bashing down the door and move on to TGR games. Our lineouts were basic two step lobs (when he hit his jumpers) no movement, no deception. just basics.

Let Rennie watch that game tape and try tell us how he thinks the Springboks attack will work let alone game plan against who might be starting.

The Argies also disrupted out kick chase game with this new tactic that's been noticed by those far more intelligent and in the know than I, where the opposite winger starts closer to our chaser and shadows his chase under the high ball and if he's the catcher he cant be accuse of blocking or shepherding . The 15 waits back for the tap back rather than coming forward onto the ball trying to compete. I think this is the first (maybe 2nd) time the Springboks would have seen this and I'm sure they'll be working on a plan to nullify it.

I'm willing to cut them some slack for that slop they dished up on Saturday when you look at what's coming up and what it means.
They won ugly and a great team is one that can win even when they're not playing well.